Depression Understood Forums

Mindset has a lot to do with getting better or worse.

The Catholic Churches has recognized that many people in the western world and other industrialized nations are disconnected from their spiritual selves and as a result the lives of others. The church has changed the focus of fasting during let to:
1. Relating one's experiences of fasting or difficult experiences to the realization that for some people this is an every day experience.
2. Doing something about it. Just one project, once a year for others.

I copied this wonderful idea from a post by Citm.

While I was composing it my computer decided to re-start itself and I lost all the work. I was so discouraged that I had to wait another day to try again. The computer re-started because it's old, and I thought why I am trying to post with this old equipment. But, I also knew if I waited a day or so I would have the energy to try again.

What do you do to get started again?

Here are some thoughts on making yourself heard by the healthcare providers in your life taken from the Lexapro and Counseling Thread:

Shattered Hopes writes:

Counseling takes time to have an effect, but its true that some counselors are much better than others.

Unfortunately, for some of us the anti-depressants only at best take a little edge off the pain...but maybe give it another two weeks then talk to your doctor, as he/she may want to switch you to something else...different meds work on different chemicals/reactors in the brain so maybe something different may give you more help?

I understand about relationships...its been almost 6 months since I was dumped, and while I don't want to risk my heart and being hurt again, I can't stand for instance those dating site commercials and people in love makes me feel a deep sense of longing...

Meanwhile, WE ARE HERE FOR YOU and WE CARE! So keep posting and reaching out here and you will make friends who understand the darkness and can relate and sometimes offer helpful suggestions on coping, at least that's what I and others have found here...

And Specter writes:

I think it's more important than I allow myself to realize: I should pay more attention on whether or not I'm being heard instead of whether or not I think I can tolerate a person. My situation only, not sure if it applies to anyone else.

It's good to keep your doctor updated on the affects of medication. If that one doesn't work, in time, they will most-likely switch it out. In time, I think they eventually find one that "fits" you. This is what a lot of people have told me. You go through a variety of them until you find the right fit and then it slowly eases you out of your depression and into a healthier mental state. Wishing this for you.

My thoughts:

To get better you need to communicate with the people who are trying to help you. Professionals are supposed to be trained to communicate, but sometimes they try to fit us into their worlds. They may think that one medicine is the best, or one therapy is the best. You need to tell them how you feel, and if they seem to pressure you, you need to ask them to help you find something or someone else that is a better fit. To get better you need to communicate, even though it feels like a risk.

My mom had a bad car accident and my grandmother had a nervous breakdown and I was abducted by a christian cult (our version of ISIS except without guns) and the stress of it all made me have a full out nervous breakdown to the point where I could no longer write in English or see reality at all.

I was put on medication for anti psychosis immediately. It was awful. I was like a puppet physically with half my strings gone. I had difficulty even sitting up.

My mom through all of this was in intense pain, but she had been spared the mental breakdown, for which I am really grateful. Eventually, she murmerd to me (as I was at her side hanging onto her hand as she laid there and babbling nonsense)... "Why am I here? And then she answered her own question. 'I know... I'm here to listen."

I don't know if any of you can relate to this at all. But, what happened is that she had expected to pass on, and didn''t. I know that feeling. I have been feeling like that ever since my car accident and the death of my husband's mother. But it comes down to.. WHY are we here. And the answer is usually right there. The answer is less about heaven, hell, the apocolypse, the primaries, the nation's security, etc. and is often MORE immediate, right there were you are.

I'm here, because this is where God wants me. I'm here, because my work with people who have mental health problems is not over. I'm here, for my husband who lost his mom. And if he had lost his wife and with a sick daughter to boot, he might not have made it and neither would the rest of the kids because of the housing market crash.

And right now, I'm here to try to put my life back together not so much for me, but for my husband and my children and to help where I can WHEN I can with other things that need a nudge.

We are good people, in bad circumstances and that's what I try to remember when 'fear' comes calling. And maybe, that's the most important thing to remember. We are here, because mental health, due to environmental issues, and an aging population in industrialized nations needs us to lead to better treatment, acceptance, etc. Just like during the civil rights movement. You are IMPORTANT and you are in a fight for rights, better health, for your life, your family's life and future patients so that their experience is less traumatic, and healing more rapid and complete.

It's not about Karma. It's not about God or not. It's not about what we deserve. I think, it's because we are good people, in tough circumstances who STILL have the power to be good people and do the right thing. If you think about it, that makes us all HEROES. Fear cannot stand up to that.

(((((hugs)))))
Never doubt that you are are needed.

Thanks Citm,

I took this from Star's "Noone Cares Thread":

I won't give up.... Thank you. Promise me that you won't give up too.

Love and Hugs Always

We are a team. Once you know that you're not alone, the other steps are easy.

Inspiring, 100footpole. Bravo, mate.

Thanks Nenkohai,

I watched a movie last night on Netflix called "Charlie's Country".

You can read the plot synopsis on Wikipedia. The movie may or may not have triggers, depending on your attitude when viewing it. Read some reviews before watching.

What was interesting to me is how the symptoms of culture clash between aboriginal culture and modern culture seem to mirror depression. The movie ends with Charlie engaging with his culture, but the point of the movie seems to be an the journey of an individual towards making a leap of faith.

Throughout the movie Charlie is a victim because he acts independently. People remark on his sense of humor without trying to understand his motivations. In the middle of the movie Charlie almost dies of exposure, for me that scene represented "rock bottom" vs. attempted self-harm. There are further scenes involving alcohol and co-dependence that could be argued as a further descent, although I view them as simply "bad guesses".

I think the overriding theme for this thread is ways for you to allow yourself to create meaning for your life. There is no ONE way, because we are all DIFFERENT. On the other hand, depression is like blinders on a horse. We can only see directly in front of us, and we don't realize that WE are our own driver, that we are depressed because the reigns have slipped from our hands, but we can get them back. This thread for me is a way to get information with my ears. To listen, to know that I have options that the blinders are hiding, but which I can understand, even if I can't see them directly.

I've been thinking a lot about types of depression. I think there are the times when we're panicing, and there are the times we're just tired.

I have panic attacks every day, but that's not the same as "out of control panicing". The last out of control attack I had like that was last November, and it wasn't as bad as one's I'd had earlier in my life. Familiarity breeds contempt for panic too.

When the last attack occurred I realized I had a plan. I already knew what could work for me. The very first thing was to look up some relaxation videos on You Tube. I did this even though I didn't feel like they would work. On the other hand I had used them before so it was worth a try. After a couple of the videos I felt a little calmer, I knew I could handle it. I was back in familiar territory. Next I made an appointment with my Dr. Lastly, I began posting on here a lot. I also went to the chat groups and made some new friends.

Once I was back on my drugs, a part of me was confident that things would turn around, even though I still didn't feel it. I quit writing in my journal, but I made lists, and after I made a list, I made a point of thinking of one more thing that I could do. The lists were things I felt I "had to do", but I gave myself permission to procrastinate, and to break things up into smaller sizes.

My measures are my lists. I'm getting more done than I used to, but I don't obsess if something on the list doesn't get done for two or three days, it will happen. I've also used the lists to say no, to know when something is too hard, and to ask for help.

I think depression makes us start to think magically ... to say if THIS happens then THAT will be. When we can't do THIS, we blame ourselves for THAT and feel even worse. It is OK to make your steps as small as you need to, the important thing is to be better over all. When you post on here I think you will find that EVENTUALLY you do get better ... Read the older posts and you can see it happen.

Am I healed? No. Am I better. Yes.

Good Luck

I copied this from Nenkohai's "Vulnerability" thread.

Today is a weird day for me. Feeling extremely emotionally vulnerable. I think events kind of accumulate for me and can bring me down if there's enough weight. Working on it.

I have to remind myself not to write exposing emails, which is what I tend to do. I think I seek comfort from someone by showing that vulnerability. Or, maybe it's just that my "shield" is down and I'm more apt to get maudlin or morose.

Already deleted an email I wrote to a co-worker that share more personal stuff that I maybe shouldn't.

Lunch time. Maybe I just need to eat something. Oi.

I think the most important part of this is the use of the "meta-idea": Resist writing exposing emails, because your belief and hope is that people will care, but experience shows in certain contexts the expected response to fear is loathing not compassion.

We need to make rational decisions about who to trust, and not just magically hope that someone will not screw us when their agenda says the reward is high enough. In fact the lower regard some people holds you in the more likely they are to screw you because THEY DO NOT FEAR YOU. I have thought about this for 30 years ... since I read Machiavelli and he concluded that it is better to be feared than loved, because fear has a longer tail. Fear constrains an enemy, love dissipates when EITHER party no longer accepts the other.

The nice thing about this board is its relative anonymity. There is no advantage to choosing to share or not to share. If someone is acting like a victim, help them to stand. Share your experience, but know that works for you will not work for others.

I need to find some posts to copy here of stories where someone is helped by the 2nd or 3rd medicine they try, or different doses. Depression makes you think in binary terms, but reality is continuous. We know that no matter how bad we feel, we will feel better, and similarly, that no matter how good we feel, that contentment will go away. Depression is the idea that those aren't simple facts or laws, that since we feel bad we must really be bad. Or, that since we feel vulnerable we need to act vulnerable. What we can control is how we act to other people when they expose their vulnerability. Look for the best ways to help, and often that is simply to listen.

And Specter writes:

I think it's more important than I allow myself to realize: I should pay more attention on whether or not I'm being heard instead of whether or not I think I can tolerate a person. My situation only, not sure if it applies to anyone else.

It's good to keep your doctor updated on the affects of medication. If that one doesn't work, in time, they will most-likely switch it out. In time, I think they eventually find one that "fits" you. This is what a lot of people have told me. You go through a variety of them until you find the right fit and then it slowly eases you out of your depression and into a healthier mental state. Wishing this for you.

... I don't wish this for myself. I don't take antidepressants, and I don't think there's something wrong with my declining in taking them. I've had many offers, many times, by many people to have my "brain chemistry" rewired with antidepressants. Many different kinds, it's hard to keep up. Forget it. My body, my choice. I'd rather end up in an E/R and risk near-death than take antidepressants, honestly. --but that's a matter of my own personal experiences, and unless someone else can experience them for me, then they probably aren't going to be inclined to understand or care why I make decisions from the experiences that I have had in the first place. It's pointless to bother explaining.

I see a therapist only and not a psychiatrist. I've been down that road before. I'm much better off suffering alone.

Therapy, as I've found, seldom helps. EMDR, from what I heard, is great, but the problem with this is that it's extremely difficult and painful for a severe trauma survivor. You have to go thru other forms of therapy first, before you can have the strength of mind to handle EMDR. This is normally for people with severe, complex PTSD and/or Dissociative Identity Disorder.

The therapist I have had this awful habit of putting words into my mouth. She throws me a pity party whenever she sees me. Pouty lips and all. What she does after that is stick her hand out and then tell me what she thinks I'm going to say, and then she just goes from there from that assumption. I go home realizing that I was not heard, but misunderstood, simply because someone felt it was easier to assume I said or meant something that I didn't say or mean. Not helpful in the slightest.

I dislike doctors, but I have an NP. Even then, I dislike anyone who tries to control my situation for the sake of their own paycheck. And that happens. And, at the end of the day, that is all that really happens. It is like this because when your own desires and will for your own well-being are being used for the sake of someone else's income, it's all too easy to get jaded and forget that a person is a person. Most people don't realize that, no matter how convinced they truly are, they are not people in the eyes of their doctor. They are a paycheck -- not a person. A paycheck only.

It feels good to think otherwise, though. I used to feel that way too. That changed years ago. You'd have to have been there to understand why.

... Here's an interesting surprise: I don't want to not be depressed. I'm not going to bother explaining the reasons why. I tried that with a psychiatrists, whom I was forced to see, no less. Didn't work out so well. Don't imagine it would work out for anyone else who has that type of mindset, either.

What I Wish for Myself:

The ability to enjoy some good food

Good times, listening to the radio

Finding someone who enjoys hugging me and enjoys my company

That a better world will come for those who believe in the power of thought

I don't care for much else. I could lose all my money, all my food, and all my willpower, and not care. You might call that "depression talking", but I call that reality. That's the difference. The world has problems, and people suffer as a result. It's that way and not the other way around. We respond to our environment, not our brain cells. Our brain cells are an indicator of the environment that we live in.

Agree to disagree. *shrugs*

Bear in mind, I've been in therapy, off and on my whole life. Since I was around the ages 4 or 5. Therapy and having "mental illness" is all I've ever known. This was because I was being traumatized by sick people who "got off" on hurting children. The system saw me as a victim, not me. They taught me to see myself as a victim, not me. Other people around me, such as my mother and grandmother, taught me that I was dirty, that I was bad, and that I was a victim and that I was shameful because of what other people thought of me, due to childhood sexual abuse.

The environment programs people. My way of thinking is that, if I can deprogram it, I can be OK.

The trick is finding people who can handle your baggage and love you at the same time. They can't perceive you as a burden and then abandon you when the going gets tough. They have to be willing to love you, no matter how awful you act or how hard you fall. And in today's world, that is super duper hard to find. It's also hard to do.

Love can make us stronger. That's all I want. Not antidepressants.

Again, agree to disagree.

Specter,

If I appear to be giving ABSOLUTE ADVICE than I am counting on you to disagree ... and because its your I know that the disagreement is with respect because that's how you roll.

With respect here is what I see when you first write:

What I Wish for Myself:

The ability to enjoy some good food
Good times, listening to the radio
Finding someone who enjoys hugging me and enjoys my company
That a better world will come for those who believe in the power of thought

Followed by the next post that says:

The environment programs people. My way of thinking is that, if I can deprogram it, I can be OK.

The trick is finding people who can handle your baggage and love you at the same time. They can't perceive you as a burden and then abandon you when the going gets tough. They have to be willing to love you, no matter how awful you act or how hard you fall. And in today's world, that is super duper hard to find. It's also hard to do.

If you have trouble with:

The ability to enjoy some good food

post about that. My wife has digestive problems, we have solved our personal problems by agreeing to disagree about what is "good food". We simply agree to not go where she does not have options.

Similarly with this:

Good times, listening to the radio

The best parts of my day are when I'm driving somewhere, and I get to listen to the radio on the way. The second best parts of my day are when I can use the radio to distract me from something I HAVE to do, and the worst parts of my day are when I HAVE TO DO THOSE THINGS WITHOUT THE RADIO.

The best I can do for myself is acknowledge that I get to CHOOSE what I HAVE to do.

Given those things: I have found someone who enjoys hugging me and enjoys my company, but we still argue 25% of the time, because we are different people. People have told me they want unconditional love, and I have told them that's not what I have to offer.

So finally I believe that a better world will come for those who believe in the power of thought, but there is nothing I can do to give them the FAITH to have that belief. THAT has to come from within, and the only time that I think its the depression talking is when you know things would be better if something happened, BUT THAT WON'T HAPPEN. I know that I would be happier if I could fly like Superman, but I don't get depressed because I will never be Superman.

I don't have trouble with any of the stuff I listed that I wish for myself. I don't know why you think I have trouble with those things, but I don't. Those are the (few) things that I still enjoy. It's not a matter of not being capable of enjoying them. They're all I have left.

What I really think is that people are easily lead to believe what professionals tell them. That's the truth of what I believe. It's not entirely that I think you want to give people absolute advice. It's that I think that professionals -- and they do this to everyone, so it's not "just you" because the same thing happened to me, and I don't even believe in trusting people -- mislead people, all for the sake of their job.

This is what I believe, and I'm sorry if that offends people. I've witnessed a lot of deceit by professionals. I've experienced abuse by professionals. This is why I believe what I believe, so I'm sorry if anyone finds that belief small-minded.

I don't know what else to say.